LOST Orientation

SPEAKER_00 0:09

Hi, and welcome to this episode of Sassin's Sips, where every week we will be discussing and dissecting an episode of Lost in Order. I'm Lisa. And I'm Agnes. And this week's episode is season two, episode three, orientation. What are you drinking today?

SPEAKER_02 0:29

So, because today I'm also medication, I'm sticking to coffee today. I will make it up and drink it like a fish on next episode. Although the last two episodes, I was pretty tipsy.

SPEAKER_00 0:48

I have um iced tea lemonade with uh vodka. Is it Staten Island iced tea? It's it's a it's Snapple um half and half. Half tea, half half lemonade. But like half of the cup is vodka.

SPEAKER_02 1:10

Awesome. You know what you should do? You should make a lemon glass. Do you see how light it is? Uh oh, I can't tell because the glass is dark. Look, look at my it's in the straw. Oh, holy shit, that thought was that's funny. I thought the straw was pretty you should make like lemon drop shots and put it in the iced tea. Well, and the lemon.

SPEAKER_00 1:31

I have I don't know, can you see the lemons? See the lemon. They're pretty they're nicely sliced. I know I had it on the cup, I was fancy, but then I was like, nah, I just want to have it.

SPEAKER_02 1:42

Okay, so Lisa's gonna be tipsy for both of us today.

SPEAKER_00 1:46

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:48

God, I'm gonna regret saying this, Lisa. I'm at like 101%.

SPEAKER_00 1:55

Oh shit.

SPEAKER_02 1:57

Yeah, like this.

SPEAKER_00 1:58

I'm like another level of excited. I I gotta hear it. I gotta hear it.

SPEAKER_02 2:02

No, I'm I'm happy. I'm so happy. Just gonna like rub it in. Um, I was like, because things are happening, and I understand the reasoning behind that the level setting and the foundation, but that's a lot of level setting for the first season. You like do like most shows, you don't get that much level setting for the whole, it's not a whole season of level setting. That's a lot of like if there wasn't more seasons, like if I wasn't watching it now, if I was watching it then, I would have stopped a long time ago. I never would have watched it.

SPEAKER_00 2:32

Um two things. So one is that when the pilot was when they filmed the pilot, now I might I might get this a little bit wrong. So when they filmed the pilot, the person who was given the green light to go ahead and film the pilot episodes um sold the show as like a scripted-ish, a scripted survivor type show. Okay, like they wanted it to be like Survivor, but scripted. Right. So they it was the most expensive pilot ever shot, if or at least one of the most expensive, right? I can see how it would be. And I mean, because even the the plane was a real plane, you know, on on the beach. But um they went ahead and they filmed it, and then the person who gave the green light to film the pilot got canned because of I guess maybe the cost or something. They also wanted it to be a show that a standalone type show where like like Law and Order, where you could just pick up at any episode and keep going and not need the episodes before it, and they're like, Yeah, yeah, yeah. So they they they really do a good job with that at all. But what happened basically it's just that they lied to just keep the show going.

SPEAKER_02 4:10

They just kind of like it's really obviously their pants the whole season.

SPEAKER_00 4:16

And so it was and it was very like, yeah. Because at first I think they had like only episodes up to like um like homecoming or something like that. And that was all they got green lighted for. And then when they saw how people were taking to the show, because they're like, yeah, no, there's not gonna be anything like supernatural, like so, like everything with like the whispers and the hatch and the uh the monster, they were they were like, We don't want any kind of supernatural stuff, and they put it in anyway, but then fans started to get really into it, so they were kind of like, Well, let's just I just they got lucky because yeah, I wasn't watching it.

SPEAKER_02 5:07

Like, I'm waiting week by week. I imagine myself watching this week by week and waiting for something to happen, and I'm like, Yes, but let me okay.

SPEAKER_00 5:16

Even still with that, I remember watching it week by week, and I couldn't wait to talk to other people about it, and it was like, What so what do you think about and you would spout theory upon theory, and so yeah, it was tough to wait, but the anticipation was kind of fun because it gave people a a chance to to talk theory.

SPEAKER_02 5:44

That first season, it just wasn't interesting enough for me to talk about it. Like I talked about because you made me talk about it. Yeah, but uh it to me I would have like, yeah, no. I think there was other shows that came on that didn't that didn't last past one season that were better, like with the event. That shit was like, oh shit, and it lasted one season. And it was every episode for me, I thought every episode was it had like it grabbed you, and it wasn't like laying a ton of foundation.

SPEAKER_00 6:18

So yeah, I still don't understand how um but I will say this we're we're only just scratching the surface of the second season, and I'm starting to like it now, but my whole thing is it's gonna take so long. Yeah, no, no, yes.

SPEAKER_02 6:34

A season just to lay foundation, so yeah, that's why I have to give this show like it's not exactly even, it's lightly down, you know what I mean? It's it's as a whole, but yeah, I'm getting there like 101%. I'm not I'll don't think I would be a 180. Like I'll never be like hate it to love it. But I found myself enjoying the show now. That's a start, and may I add, um, so you know, I'm I take notes as I'm watching the show, so I don't figure get anything to talk about. So I'm like, you know what? This is I'm gonna use my speech to text, so I can at least watch the TV as I'm doing it. And I don't use a speech to text that often. And it asterisked out my curse words. I was like, I'm being judged by my. Don't censor me. Um, but I I thought it was funny because I'm like, oh, you can't tell why I say Analusia, but you know what I'm saying, fucking. Okay, fine.

SPEAKER_00 7:56

Let's do flashbacks and then we'll do on island. If you wish. Okay. In flashback, Locke visits a support group where a woman complains that her mother stole $30 from her purse. Locke laughs at this. He explains that $30 is nothing to get upset over. Finally recounting the deception conducted by his father. He says, You want your $30 back? I want my damn kidney back. Kidney back. And it's funny.

SPEAKER_02 8:31

And the funny thing is, and he's chuckling, I knew that was gonna happen. I was like, Yeah, give it to him.

SPEAKER_00 8:36

But somebody had posted a comment on one of our Instagram photos, and they posted that line. You want your $30? I don't know if you saw that.

SPEAKER_02 8:47

I saw, but I didn't get it. I was like, huh? I didn't get it. Because obviously I haven't seen the episode yet.

SPEAKER_00 8:54

I was like, okay, well, she'll get it eventually.

SPEAKER_02 8:59

But of course, I by then I forgot about it.

SPEAKER_00 9:01

Like, I got telling, like After the meeting, he is approached by another member of the support group, Helen, who flirts with him and thanks him for saying in the meeting what she had always wanted to. Later, Helen wakes up to find Locke putting on his clothes, claiming he is uncomfortable sleeping in an unfamiliar bed. That morning, he sits in his car outside the gates of his father's estate. His father opens the car door and gets in, saying he knows that Locke has been stalking him and wants it to stop, finally telling him, Don't come back, you're not wanted. Locke does not stop, however, and at dinner during their six-month anniversary, Helen gives Locke a present, a key to her house, under the condition that he stops going to his father's house. Locke agrees, but is unable to keep his word. Helen eventually follows and sees Locke outside the gates. When she confronts him, she says he is afraid of the future, of moving past what his father has done, and move and of moving forward in his relationship with her. When he says he doesn't know what else to do, she tells him it is meant to be difficult because what she is asking him because she tells him it is meant to be difficult because what she is asking him for is a leap of faith. He seems to understand and they embrace.

SPEAKER_02 11:04

Any Um, yeah, no.

SPEAKER_00 11:07

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 11:08

No comments.

SPEAKER_00 11:09

Okay. On the island, at the underground compound, the standoff between Jack, Desmond, and Locke provides enough of a distraction for Kate to drop from the air ventilation system into the station's armory.

SPEAKER_02 11:23

So at this point, I was I am 100% sure even if she hadn't dropped into the armory room, she still wouldn't have been the one to save their asses. Just we might have thought. I don't care. She could have fallen back into the pantry again. She would have, you know, she would have. You know what I mean? It could have been tall in the bathroom. She wouldn't have found a way to save their asses. But go ahead.

SPEAKER_00 11:44

Yeah, absolutely. And I think that that's why Locke that I don't think that's the only reason Locke put her in there. I'll be honest with you. I think that that was a big part of the reason he put her in there. But I think that he put her in there because he didn't want to miss out on shit. He wanted to be front and center for the action. Not because to save her, because he he would have put her in there even if it was dangerous, I think. As long as he gets a front row seat at this uh at like the payoff of all his hard work. He wants to fuck was going on.

SPEAKER_02 12:19

And not for nothing though, he's like he he he had I mean one, it's chivalro like he looked like a fucking dick if you know what I mean, if he left her out there, let's be honest. I mean, that's one. I don't think he cares how he looks. No, but I'm like saying that's the only way to go, really. But two, he did kind of work his hatch and digging and trying to find a way to get in. So I mean, he obviously they got this like he wasn't the one to open it, but you know, that was his pet project. I think I get I can understand the desire to see something through. Whatever the task is, is like whatever it is, you you've gotten this far, you like you want to see it through.

SPEAKER_00 13:10

Kate finds and loads a shotgun. She makes her way behind Desmond and ends the standoff by striking him with the butt of the shotgun. Desmond fires around from his gun as he falls, hitting and badly damaging the computer. When a frantic Desmond claims that everyone will die unless the computer is fixed, Kate suggests that Said could repair the machine and locks sends her to retrieve him. At Jack's insistence, Desmond explains that three years ago he had been in a slow low sailing race around the world when his boat crashed on the reef surrounding the island. He was dragged off the beach by a man named Kelvin, who enlisted his help in his sole duty on the island in putting the numbers into the compound's computer and pressing the execute button every 108 minutes. Desmond says the end of the world would come if the button is not pressed. But without time to explain in detail, Desmond directs Jack and Locke to watch a film reel he's placed behind a copy of the turn of the screw.

SPEAKER_02 14:21

So before they get to this point, Jack has Desmond. I think this is before they get to this part. He has him pretty much tied up, not tied up, but restrained.

SPEAKER_00 14:35

Oh on the floor. That was like right after Kate. Yeah, that's right, right after he shoots the computer, like after Kate knocks him out, he falls. And yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:44

And then he actually tells Locke tells him, like, let him go. He's like, Don't tell me what to do. And I'm like, first of all, Jack, I don't appreciate you using Jack's using Locke's um phrase. I was personally offended by that. And then two, dude, you broke into this man's shelter. And you have the audacity to throw a gun on him and restrain him. What is this? The Christopher Columbus syndrome? Like, what the fuck? Like that whole like does anyone else have that? I was just like, really? Really? You break into this guy. Like, think about it. You break into this guy's bomb shelter. Right. You complete strangers, and you have the audacity to expect him to answer your questions. Get the fuck out of here. But Locke, I like the way Locke gets him later.

SPEAKER_00 15:40

The film welcomes its viewers to the underground compound, calling it Facility 3, the Swan, as marked by a logo that is on almost everything inside the hatch. It then goes on to describe a project called the Dharma Initiative, apparently funded by the Hansel Foundation, an experimental psychology research group. The film ends by explaining that due to an incident on the island, the viewers must enter the code into the computer every 108 minutes for the next 540 days, after which a replacement team will take over. Jack and Loc take opposite responses to this film. Jack believes this is nothing more than a social experiment, while Loc believes the film should be taken at its word. Soon after, Desmond attempts to power up the computer, but it shorts out and blows a fuse in the compound. Desmond panics, packs his stuff, some food along with some of the medicine he has been injecting himself with, something from atop the book, the third policeman, and a book with a cross on the outside, and hurriedly leaves the swan. As Desmond rushes around, Jack notices a photograph of Desmond and a woman. Jack follows behind him, leaving Loc to attempt to fix the computer alone. Locke briefly suffers an emotional breakdown. But Kate, Saeed, and Hurley arrive to help. Uninterested in the details of the situation, Saeed directs Locke Saeed directs Kate and Hurley to restore power while he fixes the computer. Outside, Jack catches up to Desmond, holding him at gunpoint. Desmond tells Jack the code, but Jack's not interested. Instead, he asks where Desmond is running to, which reminds Desmond of his earlier conversation with Jack. When Desmond asks about Jack's patient, Jack stonewalls before eventually replying that he married her. Desmond guesses from his reaction that they are no longer married. Jack lowers his gun as he begins to cry, and Desmond hastily leaves, saying, See you in another life, yeah? Inside the swan, Said successfully repairs the computer, leaving Loc to type in the numbers. When Hurley hears them, he urges Loc not to use them, but stops protesting after seeing Loc enter a wrong number. Just as Loc is about to hit the execute button, Jack arrives and tells Locke the correct numbers. Loc says Jack should be the one to hit the button, but Jack refuses. As the warning alarm sounds, the two argue. Locke asks Jack why it is so hard to believe. And Jack responds by asking why Loc finds it so easy.

SPEAKER_02 18:40

So I like to call this section like um part A of In the Island. I call the other, you know, other scene part B. So there was a scene when um after they watched the orientation video and Locke tells um dude, Jack, like, why are you so angry? Is it because it couldn't be because he didn't remember you? That couldn't be it. And I like the way it was little like check your ego, homie. I was like, Yeah. Because he saw Jack's, why can't I get the names right? He saw Jack's look of recognition when he had him by gunpoint at gunpoint. He's like, Oh, it couldn't be that he couldn't remember you. Oh, that couldn't be it at all. I was like, Yeah. Because I like Locke's subtleness.

SPEAKER_00 19:34

At that part, when they're arguing, they're setting up the projector, and Jack tells Locke, first of all, even as they're setting up the projector, Locke says his name, and Jack kind of walks away saying, like, Desmond under his breath. And he knows that he knows him. He realizes it, whether he admits it or not. Right. But then it goes on to tell Locke how that not only it's like insane and impossible what Desmond is telling them, but Jack, you just realize that this is a man that you met a few years ago at a chance encounter who told you about possibly having a miracle because maybe you fix her.

SPEAKER_02 20:22

And then boom, you end up on this desert island together. But that's normal.

SPEAKER_00 20:26

But that's not insane and or impossible. I think okay. I have I have another theory about Desmond, but we'll get there.

SPEAKER_02 20:35

Okay. And back to my I think Kate and Saeed are like the only really useful people on the fucking island.

SPEAKER_00 20:41

Said came in and is like, all right, I need you to do this, I'll do this, and it's just tell me later.

SPEAKER_02 20:47

Tell me later. Right. We just gotta obviously we've gotta fix this.

SPEAKER_00 20:50

Like he just cool comment collected, he knows what's important, and he does it.

SPEAKER_02 20:54

And I know for a fact, I hate, I know I've said it before, if he wasn't of Middle Eastern descent, he would have been the go-to person that they would have looked to as a leader on the island. And I kind not just I like it, but I I appreciate what the writers did in that situation. I can appreciate, or maybe it's really more into what they would kind of write. Um, you know.

SPEAKER_00 21:15

Well, he is this is only a couple of years after 9-11. Right, and I think he may not be the main character, but he's still a main character. So that he and and especially that they they gave him in his backstory that he fought in the Republican Guard. So it's not even like he's um Iraq Iraqi, but like of descent and lived in the States. Oh no, he's he's straight up from there fought for them against us, and he's still this really respect respectable person.

SPEAKER_02 21:57

And I I really appreciate what the writers did with the whole situation. Um, but yeah. I'm so happy today. Okay. What the fuck was the incident? That's what I want to know. What the fuck was the incident? Like the incident. Like, I'm dying to know. That's my next question.

SPEAKER_00 22:18

I um I had to start writing some stuff down because like when I go back and I edit and then I catch things. And I'm like, oh yeah, she mentioned this. So I had to start writing shit down that I could remember to, you know.

unknown 22:34

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 22:36

Did you hear me? Did that make sense?

SPEAKER_02 22:37

Yeah. In a weird way it did. Okay. Can I tell you how excited I was to see Michelle Rodriguez's name on the opening credits? I was like, ah, and Lucia.

SPEAKER_00 22:54

Okay, so your question is.

SPEAKER_02 22:57

I have a couple of questions.

SPEAKER_00 22:59

Yes. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 23:00

So the first is oh.

SPEAKER_00 23:03

Okay. Do you you wanna we'll finish doing the synopsis and then we'll do all that?

SPEAKER_02 23:09

Yeah. Um so I just want you to know that I wrote I made note of 540 days, which is kind of a weird net weird number, and 108 minutes. So I'm like, okay, I'll figure out what that what weird math that ends up with the numbers. But I say I dropped them down because I knew they were important.

SPEAKER_01 23:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:29

I've learned my lesson. I just want to tell you that I was a bio med major and studying for these studying for these episodes a lot harder than studying for any test I've ever had to take in school. I just want you to know that.

SPEAKER_00 23:46

I appreciate the effort.

SPEAKER_02 23:48

Yes, yes, yes. Alright.

SPEAKER_00 23:51

An upset Loc tells Jack it's never been easy, and that Jack needs to make a leap of faith of his own with one second left on the countdown timer. Jack presses the button. Locke, pleased, calmly says he will take the first shift at the computer. What do you think will happen if they don't press that button?

SPEAKER_02 24:17

I don't they'll all wake up from the dream.

unknown 24:20

I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 24:21

The alarm clock goes off.

SPEAKER_00 24:22

You have Jack on one side saying it it's just a social experiment. Like they're just telling you to do this shit to see if you do it or whatever, however, the social experiment works. And you have Locke saying you have to do this, it's a leap of faith. And you have Desmond saying, if you don't do it, it's it's the end of the world and we're all gonna die. So if you were there, would you be pressing the button? What would you do? Would you be Desmond? Would you be Locke? Would you be Jack?

SPEAKER_02 24:55

It depends. When am I one of the survivors of the recent plane crash? Or have have I been there? It's what your perspective your perspective changes. For example, if I if I was a Desmond, meaning let's say me and Desmond both ended up drifting on there before.

SPEAKER_00 25:13

Okay, so you got onto the island with Desmond. Right. You were on the sailboat with him.

SPEAKER_02 25:18

Right. So you have someone who's there, like there was an incident, you gotta do this. So I'm like, fuck it. Like something happened. So by now, obviously, I'm pushing. If you're one of now, if you're one of the survivors, that's like a John, John, Jack a lot. Yeah, your perspective changes because you're really coming in this to this, you're hearing this like third hand as opposed to second hand. Right. You know what I mean? You can Jack, the survivors are getting this from Desmond, who doesn't know what the incident is. He's just being told what the incident is. So you're like, so I'm too. But it's also somebody told Desmond, just like Desmond told them. Right, but I got the impression that Desmond was told by somebody who knew the incident was. Got it. That's what that's what I'm thinking. So Desmond's getting it second- my my interpretation is Desmond got it second hand for someone who knows the incident was, and then the the survivors are getting it third hand. So your thought process of the situation changes. So if I was getting it secondhand, I would press it. If I'm getting it third hand, like the survivors, man.

SPEAKER_00 26:30

But it's coming from somebody who has spent the last three years believing in this button. That's not an easy thing to ignore. Right.

SPEAKER_02 26:42

So I'm thinking I would probably press it because I've been the island for 44 days over a month at this point. This guy has been doing it every hour and a half. No, he's been pressing, he's been doing this. Obviously, no one's gotten sick. Like, okay, listen. Worst case scenario, nothing changes. What like what can what's the worst that could happen? Fucking press the button and call it a fucking day. Like he's been doing it, so this is my life thus far. Right. Not pressing it. Is it gonna make someone come get me? Maybe, but the odds are probably not. What do you mean, somebody come get you? Like, is it also gonna save us from the islands? Oh okay. Like, is it is it gonna be like boof, you're saved? Probably not. So fucking press a button. Alright. So I think I would press the button no matter what. I think my reasoning behind it will be different though.

SPEAKER_00 27:40

Across the island on the beach, Michael and Sawyer discover Jin, arms bound, being chased by a group of five people he calls others.

SPEAKER_02 27:51

The three He learned that word real quick.

SPEAKER_00 27:58

The three are attacked and quickly knocked unconscious by one of the group. The people, some dressed in contemporary clothing, drag the unconscious men in nets to a pit covered with bars made of bamboo. Sawyer, Michael, and Jin evaluate their prison, and Sawyer attempts to get above the bars by having the others boost him. The man who bested them earlier intervenes and another prisoner is dropped into the pit. When she awakens, she introduces herself as Anna Lucia, and they determine they were all on Oceanic Flight 815. Anna Lucia was in the rear section which broke off the rest of the plane in midair and landed in a different area from the other survivors. She claims to have survived on her own all this time and that she was then taken prisoner like the three men. Did you believe her story when she said it? No. So did you did you realize that they were in cahoots? No.

SPEAKER_02 29:02

I know something was off.

SPEAKER_00 29:04

Okay. Sawyer shows her that he still has his gun and that he plans to bait the guard and escape. Anna Lucia scoffs at the plan as they debate, and she manages to grab the gun and call for the guard who lifts her out of the cell. The guard asks her what information she was able to gain, and the men realize she deceived them. So what do you make of that whole situation? Her and them and what their relationship is.

SPEAKER_02 29:37

I think part of it, I think the how she survived is possible. Same way, you know, like Vince did in the fucking crate. Like remember the first okay, the dog crate survived. Um, so is it possible in Lost World? Yeah. So I believe that's possible in Lost World that she survived that way.

SPEAKER_00 30:00

What what do you mean? Like in the water? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:09

The fact because apparently that that back half like cr like fell off and cr like out of nowhere, like in mid-flight.

SPEAKER_00 30:17

Well, she said, yeah. Well, we know that it broke off in the from the rest of the plane. She said that it landed in the water and then she swam to shore.

SPEAKER_02 30:26

She also says that she that she other sheep like floated on something and and like she was a piece of the anyway. I got the impression that she uh I don't I don't know. Maybe I I don't know. She said something like she wasn't talking clearly or something. It was kind of like m I don't know. She floated on something and then I don't know, until she was able to swim to shore.

SPEAKER_00 30:49

Like Yeah. So I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 30:52

Like she landed in the water and swam to shore. Like the fact that um everybody like they okay, we thought that everyone was dead from the back half of the plane. As of now, we think everyone died from the back half of the plane. So I think whatever she that she, yeah, she survived. Okay, great. But um over a month by herself, and we know as viewers that there's other people on the island. So the odds are kind of slim that that's a hundred percent true.

SPEAKER_00 31:25

Say that again.

SPEAKER_02 31:26

I say so as viewers, we know it's we okay, she's been on the island by herself.

SPEAKER_00 31:31

You mean that she survived by herself over a month?

SPEAKER_02 31:34

Yes, and as viewers, we know that there's others on the island. So not that she survived by herself, but there's others on the island. How does she not come across them up to now?

SPEAKER_00 31:49

Okay, well number one we so far also have the impression, if not the fact, that Rousseau has been on this island alone for 16 years. Because she said that she she shot her crew or she killed her crew because she said they got sick, right? And as far as we know, she's alone.

SPEAKER_02 32:16

But on why they want to be alone. They want like you know say the people already on the island. The others, okay. Russo wants to be alone. The others, I'm talking about the others.

SPEAKER_00 32:29

But but what is the like that maybe that's the part that I'm not that I don't know what what do you think is the relationship to uh to the from the others to Ana Lucia? I think they found her before, like before a month.

SPEAKER_02 32:41

That's what I say. The fact that she was alone for a whole month before coming across them didn't make sense. So you think that they're like together, working together. She like, yeah, because what are the odds of her being on that's what I was trying to say? The odds of her being alone got it for a whole month, and we know there are others on the island. They didn't cut she didn't come because they made themselves known to them the first what two weeks when they tried to kidnap Claire and her baby. Like, you know, they made themselves known when they like so the fact that they didn't know she was on the island before now doesn't make sense. So I think she came across them way before the day before.

SPEAKER_00 33:17

That the others put her in the pit as a plant to find out information. Well, isn't that obvious? I thought I thought that part was obvious. I was saying shit. I hate lost, I hate this shit because I don't I don't want to say the wrong thing and confirm or deny.

SPEAKER_02 33:34

I think I think she's used I think she's doing I think she came across them and they probably the same thing to her and she's using and she's trying to I don't say Stockholm syndrome, but she's doing the best she can to survive.

SPEAKER_00 33:51

But what if those are not what if the others don't exist and those are not others but just other people from the plane?

SPEAKER_02 34:01

Okay, so we want the boy. So you think they so you think they're from the plane too?

SPEAKER_00 34:08

Maybe. Maybe that's how they knew there was a boy.

SPEAKER_02 34:10

We want the boy.

SPEAKER_00 34:12

I mean, that doesn't explain where they got a boat, but the boat might have been there from a previous I was gonna say, like Desmond lost his boat, so that might be that might have been maybe that's Desmond's boat.

SPEAKER_02 34:25

Those others might not have been there. My head is spinning mind blown.

SPEAKER_00 34:31

Like sorry. I just I really love to like always give you a second option when you think you haven't figured out. I never have it figured out, even though sometimes you're so like like right on the truth, and you just want to fuck with me, and I just want to fuck with you, yeah. So what I just told you could be the absolute truth, or it could be like a million miles away because you were at the truth, you know, whatever. I hate you.

SPEAKER_02 34:58

I have a deep-seated passion.

SPEAKER_00 35:00

I know you do. Let's okay.

SPEAKER_02 35:14

Of course you do. You just want to drive me crazy.

SPEAKER_00 35:19

Yeah, I think that Desmond, I love the character dynamic between Jack and Desmond because I feel like Desmond exists to fuck with Jack's head. Because you And I appreciate that. You have this man who is all about science and concrete things, and Desmond starts talking to him about back when he met him the first time about America, you could fix her, and then he did. And now all these however many years later, which we know that it's at least three years later, here's Desmond again talking to him about the end of the world and a magic button, and once again taking Jack's sense of concrete thinking certainty and fucking it all up because now it's like how could like you could see the wheels in his head turning. Like, how could this be happening?

SPEAKER_02 36:23

I like I actually like that about Desmond, and I told you he's on his current show now, and um obviously he's 20 years older about, you know, give or take. And kind of sexy. Um he's kind of sort of but anyway.

SPEAKER_00 36:43

Um when Desmond asks about Sarah.

SPEAKER_02 36:50

I had a feeling that what you call that he's dead, that she's dead. I don't know why that popped in my head.

SPEAKER_00 36:55

Well, Jack started crying, and Desmond is like, okay, so I I get the like the idea that's not together.

SPEAKER_02 37:02

Right.

SPEAKER_00 37:03

So now we don't we know that they're not together, and we know that apparently it's a painful whatever happened is painful. So we don't we I think assuming she's dead is kind of like you know.

SPEAKER_02 37:18

Oh, maybe his father had an affair with her before.

unknown 37:21

That's I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 37:23

I I wouldn't be I mean I wouldn't be surprised with the whole daddy issue thing.

SPEAKER_00 37:28

There is okay, there's only like one trivia, and it's kinda like weird. There's two, but one of them I can't read you yet. The chalkboard present at Locke's Anger Management Group is titled Transforming Anger and has the following subsections Call the Truth with Anger and Anger Love Connection. Rewire your hot button, tell your story, get good at grieving, and stay in tune with yourself. And I I feel like these are it's it's like an outline of what is happening on the island. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 38:18

Give it to me again.

SPEAKER_00 38:19

Okay, so number one is call a truce with anger, which I kind of take it as like um like Jack and and Locke and Desmond, they're all kind of like okay, like truce almost, because they have to now work together to fix a computer. Although an anger love connection would be Locke and Helen.

SPEAKER_02 38:42

Right.

SPEAKER_00 38:43

And then number three is rewire your hot button, which is kind of literal because the they shot it, so probably hot and now it has to be rewired. Tell your story. Jack asks for Desmond's story, get good at grieving. I mean, whatever, that's and stay in tune with yourself.

SPEAKER_02 39:13

It okay, so remember the last week we're talking about the name of the organization, Dharma. And I'm like, I know that means something, and it has something to do, like I and I couldn't, so I I Googled it. And depending on the religion, Hindu, Hinduism, hit Hinduism, Buddhism, um in the short version, it's moral, it's a moral law. Um, your short version. I think it is, it's um pretty much your moral virtue or the moral law. Um and it kind of makes sense with the whole theme of lost, and you find how all these people who have maybe been bad or have done bad things or had bad thoughts or weren't pure, are actually coming into themselves and becoming more virtuous and more moral in their actions. So, I know last week you're like, oh, the name doesn't mean that much. I think it has a lot to do with the the the premise of this show, damn it. Mm-hmm. So that's it. I'm going back to sleep. No, no, I'm awake. All right, fine.

SPEAKER_00 40:35

You mentioned 108 minutes. 108 minutes and 540 days. That bugged me the fuck out. 108 is the sum of all the numbers.

SPEAKER_02 40:49

I knew it was something. Alright.

SPEAKER_00 40:54

Um, let me see what else is here. We meet Helen.

SPEAKER_02 41:01

Any thoughts on Helen? I think good for Locke. That's yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:10

We have talk about electromagnetism in the video. And you I think you mentioned that before.

SPEAKER_02 41:17

Wait, before, wait, wait, wait. 108 minutes times five is 540. There you go. Okay. So the numbers, the sum of the numbers times five is 540. Uh I would have gotten the little equation if I would have thought about it. So, what's that last thing you were talking about? Helen? Electro no, oh electromagnetism.

SPEAKER_00 41:44

Yeah, that they men mention electromagnetism in the video that they watched. And you had mentioned something about electromagnetism. I remember you mentioning it. I mean, they also talk about parapsychology and all this other kind of stuff. Did you see the polar bears in the video? I did, I did, I did, I did. Duological studies and stuff, yes.

SPEAKER_02 42:09

Well, wait, I try to think what genius moment I had. I have all these moments, and then I don't, you know, I just talk out my ass. So you know, a clock is right two times twice a day, so even a broken clock is right. Okay. That's all I was trying to say.

SPEAKER_00 42:24

The video said that this is station three. But it also there was a notation where it said three out of six.

SPEAKER_02 42:38

Right.

SPEAKER_00 42:39

So, which gives us the impression that there's six other stations. Somewhere in the world. Well, I'm sorry, thank you. Five other stations. Somewhere in the world, if not on this island.

SPEAKER_02 42:52

And this one is all the one that has the whole electromagnetic. This is I'm sorry. Remember, I I compared this little section like to like another, like you know, triangle.

SPEAKER_00 43:01

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_02 43:01

Well, and remember when Jack electromagnetic.

SPEAKER_00 43:07

When Jack came down the hatch, you saw the key on his neck.

SPEAKER_02 43:12

Go up.

SPEAKER_00 43:13

Yeah. Yeah. So this is the Swan Station, and the video was um the whatever, yeah, it was Dr. Marvin Candle. The person on the video. Yeah, Dr. Marvin, Dr. Marvin Candle. And he talked about the Dharma Initiative was originated in 1970 by Gerald and Karen DeGroot from the University of Michigan. And it was like with the support of Alvar Hanso, and the video was copyrighted 1980 by the Hanso Foundation. So this is obviously even at that point, which is supposed to be 2004, it's still a t almost a 25 year old video. So does that give credence or does that you know, like what do you I mean, on one hand, okay, on one hand And you have a video from almost from over 20 years ago telling you about this the experiment and how it's important and due to an incident that they don't specify, and clearly this piece is missing from the video, from the um film.

SPEAKER_02 44:42

You're right. I have a I thought the film was so was a little too dated even for the 80s. I thought the film was older.

SPEAKER_00 44:53

It might have been. I mean because I was feeling like they talk about because they talk about the Dharma Initiative being formed in 1970, but the copyright could just mean the last time that the video was given out.

SPEAKER_02 45:07

Right, I'm gonna see because I was like, but and then it was after the incident. What the fuck was the incident? Another season-long question.

SPEAKER_00 45:15

But as we've seen in the last couple of episodes, even though a lot of things in the hatch look dated that they can go back to the 70s and the 80s, that washer and dryer is brand new.

SPEAKER_02 45:27

Right, it's like as people end up on the island, it gets updated, like a piece here, a piece there, as something gets added, as everybody who ends up on the island adds something.

SPEAKER_00 45:37

And there's still food, and the food is obviously not expired, it's still good to eat, so it can be 20 years old. I mean, unless it's filled with twin.

SPEAKER_02 45:49

Oh, so you feel like it's like the corporation is still having the experiment.

SPEAKER_00 45:54

So, right. So, how do you explain it it's like cognitive dissonance, you know? On one hand, you have this like really old foundation, and nobody has said anything, and you're just still here pushing a button for years, and nobody tells you shit. But on the other hand, clearly something is something or son one is still looking out for this patch. This right, this station. You you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 46:27

So so how do you don't because something's not won, something's wonky. You don't weigh it, it's illogical, and something is really wonky with this this fucking island.

SPEAKER_00 46:42

Okay, remember when they were digging down into the hatch and the episode Born to Run, and they they did the time machine, the Kate and her the time capsule, right, with her friend Tom, who was like her childhood lover. And remember I was saying that I wanted to make a connection, but I couldn't.

SPEAKER_02 47:10

Okay, what was the connection with the time capsule? The hatchets of the time capsule?

SPEAKER_00 47:14

It's kind of like a time capsule because they dug down into it and there was stuff from obviously years before still preserved in there.

SPEAKER_02 47:26

That's funny.

SPEAKER_00 47:28

But I couldn't tell you that then because you still thought it was like an underground city where the others lived.

SPEAKER_02 47:35

Well, it's still an underground something. It is underground.

SPEAKER_00 47:38

You did say like a laboratory or something, which if this is an experiment.

SPEAKER_02 47:43

No, you know, I did I did say a lab or something. The underground city was my connection to the show that's being played now that he currently works on, like the whole underground living situation was a connection. I had a fun fact about you.

SPEAKER_00 47:56

I was so excited. You also said that the others placed a recording of directions in the hatch. Now, we don't know who quote unquote the Dharma Initiative is per se, but that film isn't that kind of like a recording of directions.

SPEAKER_02 48:17

Directions. I'm so fucking smart, even when I'm not paying attention. Either that or you're cheating. I'm a professional TV watcher. Telling you, Oxum's razor. No matter how impossible it seems, the simplest answer is usually the answer. As said by Sherlock Holmes.

SPEAKER_00 48:42

Okay, I'm just trying to update my notes. Okay, so you had questions. You wanted to know what was the incident and what are the questions you how was it? I got it. The man for the numbers. Okay, and one of the questions that you obviously had going back to Born to Run was how did the airplane get into the safety deposit box?

SPEAKER_02 49:04

And you thought of that. Yeah, you thought it was a wife saving her husband's stuff, but yeah, okay. It was someone saving it. It was the lid, yeah. Because obviously, I but I still think I go back to my notes sometimes, and I still think she was on the run prior to the to this. Because obviously the bake incident happened after the hospital incident, and I feel like she was on the run before that. Because why else was she hid her face from the sheriff? I still want to know why she was on the run to begin with, and what is the fucking incident? I know the incident is the island doesn't exist. Oh, there was some kind because you know they say um that we are currently living in a parallel lunar, we have we live in parallel universes, and so the island is not it's not it's on earth, but it's not on this universe, it's on a parallel universe. So they have some kind of electromagnetic quirk and end up on a different universe.

SPEAKER_00 50:18

Okay, I mean, let's say silly. Now let's say you were right. Would you like me to tell you?

SPEAKER_02 50:28

No, of course not.

SPEAKER_00 50:30

Okay, so yeah, you're way off.

SPEAKER_02 50:32

Because we're no, because yeah, you're right that no you're lying. Um, because um, because if you if you would ever tell me the truth, I'll stop watching the show and there'll be in this and we'll we'll be on to another another show.

SPEAKER_00 50:47

That's true. I'm telling you, there there are times where you have like hit the nail on the head, and I'm like, this bitch, like like even when you said, Oh, it's it's recording direct a recording of directions, and I'm thinking of the film, and I'm like, This bitch, like granted, it's not I mean, but probably how you meant it, but that's exactly what it is.

SPEAKER_02 51:11

Because that's what I said, half of the shit that people are surmising watching this 20 years later, the writers probably had no intention of what that meant. It was just like completely, well, it's like, yeah, that's exactly what we went. What the fuck are they talking about? Like, you know what I mean? It's probably like a spin the wheel, like a chore of charts, spin the wheel, and let's add this in it. Like everything can like in hindsight, everything can see a connection that really was no connection there to begin with.

SPEAKER_00 51:38

So we we had a lock episode.

SPEAKER_02 51:45

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 51:46

How did you feel about getting more about Locke's history?

SPEAKER_02 51:52

It was interesting to know more about him. It but it wasn't I didn't have any notes on him. Okay, that's good to know.

SPEAKER_00 51:58

The last time we had a lock episode, you said that it was just basically straight to the point. And do you feel like it's the same this time? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 52:08

Locke for me doesn't have he's he's mysterious, but he's not a man of mystery, if that makes any sense. Um, the way his mind works is mysterious. Um, but he's pretty straightforward. There's not whereas Kate is like, what the fuck? Why is she on the run? What does she do? There's not that many questions. Um, Locke's story, Locke's flashbacks give you more insight into the man he is, but he doesn't have many questions. Like, yeah, you want to know how he ended up in a wheelchair, but it's not how he ended up to wheelchair for me is integral to know who he is right now. I feel like he's always been this way, you know. So you kind of get who he is from right from the beginning, and you understand yeah, you understand who he is and why he is so this flashback takes place after the kidney incident, but clearly before he's in a wheelchair. You're so smart, yes.

SPEAKER_00 53:09

Thanks. So we still don't know how he got into the wheelchair. You want to take a guess?

SPEAKER_02 53:20

He's climbing over the fence to get his keys that she threw over, and he ends up getting shot by the security guard. I don't know. Or fault, yeah, I don't know.

unknown 53:31

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 53:31

Don't look at that tone of voice.

SPEAKER_00 53:35

Next the title of the episode is Orientation. Now, aside from the obvious connection, because the film was called Orientation. Do you have any insights?

SPEAKER_02 53:54

Yeah, no. I mean, you could all you could play like Freud, who yes, I know has been debunked. Um, and it's like, you know, this is this this is the episode where everyone kind of orientates themselves with normal once again.

SPEAKER_00 54:13

I like that.

SPEAKER_02 54:14

Well, thank you. Thank you very much, boss.

SPEAKER_00 54:17

I think this is not only that, because they're kind of like you know, orientation is like when you're new to something, and now they're new to the hatch. So yes, the video, but the bigger picture, it's like there's a new entity on the island.

SPEAKER_02 54:35

And I also think it's gonna I think it's a point of the new roles on the island. I have a feeling people's roles are gonna change.

SPEAKER_00 54:42

But also the people who are across the island, it's like there's this forget about them sometimes. Yeah, but it's it's another kind of like entity orientation. Now you're with these unknown people and it's like they haze you, they threw your asses in a pit.

SPEAKER_02 55:04

I feel sorry for them because I like it's funny. I don't know. I I like I like those three people together, Michael, Jen, and Sawyer together, I like them. There's a because it's so different, but they're so but at the same time, they they work well together. They do, they work very well together, and I think part of them hates the fact that they work well together. And yeah, even though I might not like you, let's say, you know, uh, he gets on my nerves. Um, they've been in the island stranded for over a month, and there is a sense of of friendship or comedy, camaradie. I'm done. Camaraderie. Thank you. I got the words today, don't worry. I speak better when I'm drunk. Um, so I think this just brings it all to a head. Like it's easy to nitpick on the stupid shit when things aren't as dangerous when you really and and and forget that there is a bond growing there. And I think the situation just shows that yeah, yeah, that's that. I'm babbling once again. So this is this is this this part where you tell every I had I dreamed that you fired me and got a new co-host.

SPEAKER_00 56:28

Yes, yeah, I guess. Yes, I guess I had a dream that she fired me. I still don't know if that was a hope or a fear kind of dream.

SPEAKER_02 56:38

A hopeful fear or a fearful hope. I don't know. It depends what day of the week it is. It depends on my mood. It changes.

SPEAKER_00 56:46

After okay, so let's let's just recap. After watching this episode, we've got a little bit more information about the hatch and its purpose.

SPEAKER_02 56:56

We don't have much weight. Right. They give you a little they give you a little something, but they give you shit more confusion at the process.

SPEAKER_00 57:08

We have a little bit more information about the hatch and its alleged purpose.

SPEAKER_02 57:14

Alleged, I like that, yes.

SPEAKER_00 57:16

Um a little bit more on Desmond and how he got there, and uh not much more about the others or uh Jin Sawyer and Michael. And we did we did meet Anna Lucia on the island, so we know that she survived and she's there.

SPEAKER_02 57:40

I have a question. The others seem so hostile to the new people. I feel like them being on the island. Okay, let's say they were playing. I wonder what I have a poor connection. Hold on. Okay, my connection is poor. Okay, so scenario one. The others are from the other part of the plane, and for them to be so hostile, it makes me wonder what did they encounter the 40 plus days they've been on the island. The survivors we know aren't as militant as a group as the others are. So, a if they are part of the same thing, what the fuck happened to them to be so combatant and militant and hostile to new people? Like what the hell did they they encounter? And that's A, assuming that maybe it's B, maybe they weren't from the same. Oh, wait, so if they are part of the same, oh, new thought. If they are part of the same, Anna Lucia was never by herself, they were from the same part of the plane that ended up landing. She was part of them to begin with, she was never by herself. You mean if if like if the others were part of an well, other survivors from the same plane crash, you say the back of the plane. Oh, okay, okay. If the others were from the same plane crash, but uh from the back of the plane. This guy.

SPEAKER_00 59:34

So the the so the others that are referenced are just people who were on the back of the plane. That's yeah.

SPEAKER_02 59:41

What if that's what they're all just yeah?

SPEAKER_00 59:46

And that's who and you mean it like that's who Ethan was?

SPEAKER_02 59:51

Maybe. No, because Ethan was with Rousseau. Because Ethan was never on the manifest to begin with. Oh, right, right, right. So Ethan, so that's what that's why I thought there was other people on the on the there has to be others other other than the other than the plane crash because he was on the manifest.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:10

Okay, so we know that so wasn't on the manifest, and we know that Ethan was not on the manifest. So those two people were not what so I'm I'm talking out loud.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:23

So she's referenced the others, she's referenced others, so the others obviously other people before the crash. Like it wasn't like the others can't be from I don't think the others are from the crash now, because she's referenced others as if you get the impression that it has before like it was a long-standing group of people, like it's something else. So okay, I'm just I'm just spitballing, I'm throwing a whole bunch of different shit. So I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:48

Well, she said that the others took her baby. So that's going back 16 years. Right, way before Oceania.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:00

Right, so so maybe these group of people either A are the others, or B, they're not the others. We're just assuming they're the others and they're from the back of the plane. And they're just assuming and then survivors, our survivors, I call them our survivors on weekends, are just assuming that they're the same others that they're talking about.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:26

Got it.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:27

I mean, those are two good, two good solid theories. I'm throwing out all the theories because nothing makes sense to a lot of one of them, one of them's gonna stick, right? Well, the spaghetti in the wall and something's about to stick. Um, and no, I've never tested my spaghetti like that. I don't understand that. Why waste spaghetti if I throwing it on a wall? You get to eat it. At most, at worst case, it's crunchy. You still fucking eat that shit. But anyway.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:57

So, okay, so we have after this episode, these are the questions that I have written down. Who sent Kate the letter? Why did they want Claire's baby? Well, why do they want Claire slash Claire's baby? What was the incident? Why was Kate on the run? How did Locke get in the wheelchair? What the fuck happened to the others to be so militant? And if they are part of the same group, then Anna Lucia was never by herself.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:36

What letter?

SPEAKER_00 1:02:38

The letter that she received at the motel to that told her that her mom was in the hospital.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:46

Oh, right, right, right, right, right.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:48

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Okay. So with this episode, I mean, we obviously see Anna Lucia again, that we saw her in the finale, and now we realize that she did get on the plane, she did survive the plane crash, and she's on the island.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:12

Which which we knew already. Because boss made her famous. One you know what I mean? So we knew she was on the show. It's cheating, not cheating.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:24

Yeah, yeah. Next week's episode is Everybody Hates Hugo.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:35

So Hugo.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:37

Needless to say, it's a Hurley episode.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:40

Is it? I couldn't tell.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:41

Any thoughts about Hurley? This is only gonna be the second flashback that we get for him.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:47

Um, I love Hurley, and that was it. That's all I can remember. I remember saying the next show was everyone hates Hurley.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:55

Are you looking for Hugo? Is there anything that you're hoping Wow, the sound is so much better right now. Is there anything that you're hoping to find out or to get more information?

SPEAKER_02 1:04:09

No, nothing particular. I have no dying questions. I have nothing that's burning, burning to a hole in my brain. No.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:19

Okay. Well, then I guess that'll do it for this episode. Stay tuned next week when we will do discuss everybody hates Hugo and learn more about Hurley. And in the meantime, if you'd like to support the show, you can do so at patreon.com dash saspod. And if you become a patron, you will have access to videos and pictures and unedited footage, audio and video, where you will see just what train wrecks Agnes and I both are.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:03

Like they can't tell now. You get a bigger picture. It is not for the faint apart.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:11

If you choose not to support us financially, that's fine. You can also support this show by engaging with us and following us on social media. You can also tell your friends, like we've said before, grab their phones and just download our show into it. That helps. That really helps. Tell your friends, share our episodes. Yeah, that's those are good ways.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:39

You can mock us together. That can build, that can just strengthen your friendship. We are all about friendship here. Even if no matter which way that looks.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:50

And as always, please drink responsibly. Don't drink and drive. Until next time. I'm Lisa. And I'm Agnes. We out of here.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:03

Peace.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:12

We're never doing it. Oh, I forgot a I realized a question. What happened to Sarah? Okay. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Alright.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:28

Forgot about her. Alright, I forgot about you, Miss Sarah.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:31

Alright. Well, another episode. And the can. I thought we were supposed to start watching the episodes together.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:44

No, we I I don't no. No. No. Because you're like you're a micro manager TV watcher. No. No.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:54

All right, what if I promise not to be? Can I have another chance? Can I have a second chance?

SPEAKER_02 1:07:02

We'll see. I don't know.