LOST Whatever the Case May Be

SPEAKER_00 0:07

Yeah, well, you should be out here a lot, not after what happens. No, I'm fine. I can take care of myself. Of course. I don't need to protect it. I can take care of myself. What you smell blood on the way.

SPEAKER_01 0:41

I'm Lisa. And I'm Agnes. And we are your hosts. And welcome to Sassin's Tips, where every week we will be discussing and dissecting an episode of Lost in Order. And drinking.

unknown 0:55

A lot.

SPEAKER_01 0:58

And we've already started. I don't think anyone's gonna tell. What are you drinking today? What are you sticking on? I am keeping it light with Stella. I made myself a spiked lemonade.

SPEAKER_02 1:18

Nice. Nice summer drink.

SPEAKER_01 1:23

In the butt-ass cold of winter.

SPEAKER_02 1:26

Right. But if you drink it, they will come.

SPEAKER_01 1:30

I sure hope so. Okay. This week we're talking about Kate in the episode Whatever the Case May Be. And I will be reading a synopsis, and then we will just talk about themes and things that spark our interest. Sounds like a plan, Stan. Unlike the previous couple of episodes where I broke it down in linear order, I'm just gonna start with the flashback and then we'll move on to the on island stuff.

SPEAKER_02 2:06

Let's get this party started.

SPEAKER_01 2:09

So the flashbacks are to take place in 2002. A group of masked robbers break into a bank while Kate, under the alias Miss Ryan, is applying for a loan with an employee named Mr. Hutton. The bank robbers hold her and everyone else in the bank captive, threatening to kill them if access to the money cage is not granted. A man attempts to grab one of the robbers, forcing him to lose his gun, which slides over to Kate. Kate claims she is unable to use the gun. Gee, where have I heard this before? Thus ending the insurrection. To punish her, another robber takes her inside of a room, only to reveal that Kate is a participant in the robbery as well. Did you see that coming?

SPEAKER_02 2:59

Yeah. You knew Wait, when they open up to the bank, I was like, okay, this is okay, it makes sense. Like she wasn't a run for nothing. So yeah, I wasn't surprised. It made sense.

SPEAKER_01 3:10

The two kiss. To keep up the charade, Kate, known to Jason as Maggie, asks him to hit her. Kate returns with a bloody face, and Jason pretends to threaten her life while demanding the cage's key from Hutton. Assured of the senior employee's reaction, Kate fakes an attempt to stop him, claiming that Jason will kill her anyway. However, he agrees to cooperate in order to save her life. Inside the cage, Hutton then asks them to release Kate, after which Jason sarcastically reveals her trickery and points his gun to shoot him. Kate, having been promised that nobody would be hurt in the robbery, intervenes by shooting Jason in the leg as well as shooting his other two accomplices. She then demands from Hutton the bank key to deposit box 815, revealing that she has the customer key. Obtaining the bank key, Kate opens the box and finds a yellow envelope inside. Questions. Do you think that this is why Kate is on the run?

SPEAKER_02 4:11

I don't even know. I didn't think about it. I'm like, it could be, but it could not be. It could be something else.

unknown 4:16

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 4:16

Um, yeah, I didn't even that thought never c I didn't think about it like that. And did you I mean, if it is, yeah, it makes sense. But if it isn't, something else happened afterwards, that would make sense also. I I think it has a lot to I think it's more of a story to the reason she's when she wanted to take deposit box.

SPEAKER_01 4:38

And did you catch the safety deposit box number?

SPEAKER_02 4:41

A15.

SPEAKER_01 4:44

Sound familiar?

SPEAKER_02 4:46

Yeah, I don't know where I heard that number before.

SPEAKER_01 4:54

Okay. So on the island, it's day 21. In the jungle, Kate is in a tree picking fruit. She loves to climb trees.

SPEAKER_02 5:05

Every time you say in the jungle, I want to start singing and we must wear.

SPEAKER_01 5:10

In the jungle, the mighty jungle. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 5:14

I'm leaving that in. People are turning up their huh?

SPEAKER_01 5:17

I'm leaving that in. We're not in the body.

SPEAKER_02 5:20

Yeah, but people are gonna turn off they're gonna they're gonna like turn off the podcast.

SPEAKER_01 5:25

Maybe they wanna hear you sing.

SPEAKER_02 5:28

No one wants that.

SPEAKER_01 5:32

After climbing down, she hears something moving in the bushes. She quickly throws a rock in the direction of the noise, hitting what turns out to be a stalking sawyer. He comes out cursing. I love No one in the world says son of a bitch like him.

SPEAKER_02 5:48

Really? I'm serious. This is yes. Son of a bitch. He says, son of a bitch.

SPEAKER_01 6:01

Ow. He comes out cursing and holding his knee with a rock hit, claiming he was only watching over her. They hear falling water nearby and follow the sound to a waterfall spring. Sawyer takes off his shoulder and rushes into the water, encouraging Kate to follow. What a scene. After some frolicking, they swim to the rocks, climbing up and diving back in. Underwater Did you just say frolicking? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:32

Like they have wood like wood nips and shit, frolic Okay, but go ahead, I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_01 6:36

Like some Disney creatures, yeah. Yeah. Underwater they spot two dead bodies from the plane strapped into their seats. When they surface, Sawyer decides to dive again to check the passengers' belongings. Kate, disgusted at the thought of raiding dead bodies, follows to stop him. However, she then notices a familiar haliburton case trapped underneath one of the seats. As both emerge from the water, Kate asks Sawyer to help her fetch the case, claiming it's hers. They dive back down, and Sawyer retrieves the haliburton case after some struggle and hands it to Kate. She seems puzzled at how to open it, leading Sawyer to realize the case is not hers. He takes it back to check her reaction. Kate acts indifferent and heads back to camp, leaving the case with him to avoid answering his questions about it. Back at the camp, the survivors are busy retrieving luggage from the crash that was washed onto the beach by the tide. This is the first hint that something is special about it. Jack notes to Saeed that at the rate the tide is rising, the fuselage will soon be submerged. He says people should move to the caves. However, Said notes many survivors are worried about entering the jungle after Claire's kidnapping. Jack asks Said to take him to Rousseau to ask her more about the other she talked about, but Saeed expresses his doubts of Rousseau's sanity and debunks his own account of hearing the others' whispers. As an alternative, Saeed agrees to try deciphering Rousseau's maps and notes in hopes of locating Claire and easing the suffering of the traumatized Charlie. No one is even looking for Claire.

SPEAKER_02 8:18

Listen, I had this thought, like on this episode, I didn't think about it as much. But as time progresses, I'm like, um, hello, Miss Ly. Like, no one seems to even talk about her, have a plan and action. Like I get not running out in the woods all within Millie, but there's no like plan in place. No, okay, this is what we're gonna do. We're gonna have it's just weird to me. This whole thing is weird. Besides the like the lost the writers and their weird like the island itself is weird. People's reaction to things are kind of weird to me. I don't know. I don't know if that's just the way their character are written or is it for a reason? But yeah, it's totally weird.

SPEAKER_01 9:07

Yeah, but Jack is the type of character that reacts first and thinks later. Every time that we've seen him, he's always just go, go, go, and it's usually somebody else that somebody else nearby that's kind of reining him in. Like, wait, Jack, let's think about this. And he's like, No, we have to act.

SPEAKER_02 9:28

But he's I don't know if you notice this, but after he acts, he doesn't give a fuck anymore. I feel like his reaction is superficial. So maybe that's just me. I think he does it because he feels like he has to. He's like he's a martyr to his feelings or some shit. He was so gung-ho, and then it's like, okay, okay, I'm done. I have my I did what I was supposed to do. I'm done now.

SPEAKER_01 9:53

Meanwhile, Boone lies to Shannon when she asks him about the time he spends with Locke, claiming that they are looking for Claire. He notes that both Shannon and himself are perceived as a joke among the s among the survivors, but at least he is trying to contribute while she is being useless. At night, Kate sees Sawyer heading back to his tent with the Halliburton case. She waits for him to fall asleep, then slips in and tries to steal the case. Sawyer feels her movement and grabs her. This part was so funny to me. She she tried to sneak it away from him. He had it in between his legs, and she ends up he ends up wrapping his legs around her. And she's like, get all. He likes it.

SPEAKER_02 10:35

I don't know. She likes him. She really does. And you know what's kind of funny to me? Uh the way everyone refers to it as a Halliburn case, and everyone just knows it instinctively, like that's like the top tier of security for briefcases. I was like, right. I was like, who knows that? Like it's some these are people that I don't know. I wouldn't think in the normal everyday life know the security of this briefcase.

SPEAKER_01 11:06

Okay, Michael, we know, was in construction. So why would he know about a Halliburton case?

SPEAKER_02 11:14

I mean, what's right, everyone's like, oh, you never go into that.

SPEAKER_01 11:18

And I'm thinking, how the floor is really we don't know his story yet, but so maybe there's a reason he knows, but but he wasn't the only one.

SPEAKER_02 11:29

Everyone who mentioned it, they're like, oh yeah. Like I was like, um, okay. Weird, but okay. Told you everyone here was weird. Like my thought process watched Times, and what episode what episode are we into? Like a billion into season one?

SPEAKER_01 11:47

13.

SPEAKER_02 11:48

But I I feel like this is like I see dead people kind of thing. Like everyone they like they're not really alive. Like, like I feel like it's gonna be six seasons of them living their lives, but they're not really alive.

SPEAKER_01 12:03

So it's like sixth the sixth sense, the TV show. Uh-huh. Yeah. The next day, Said approaches the sunbathing Shannon, asking her to help him translate the French notations on Rousseau's maps. Though she initially suspects it to be a trick put up by Boone, she reluctantly agrees to help. Michael and Hurley pass by Sawyer and mock his failing attempts of picking the lock on the Halliburton case, is what we just said. Michael then suggests using force and impact to open the case. In the jungle, Loc and Boone continue their attempt to open the hatch using the axe Boone smuggled. At the beach, Rose tries to help Charlie snap out of his depression by asking him to help her move her luggage. Later in the jungle, Sawyer follows Michael's advice by hitting the case on some rocks several times, but the case still refuses to open. Frustrated, he climbs up a tree and throws the case down. Again, it fails to open. While he is still up the tree, Kate suddenly rushes in and picks up the case from the ground and runs away with it. Sawyer soon catches up with her, gets the case back, and makes Kate a proposition. He promised to give her the case on the condition she tells him what is inside. Kate again refuses to talk and lets him leave with it. This is like the longest game of Tom and Jerry ever.

SPEAKER_02 13:29

When you put it that way, I haven't a really bad or good habit, depends how you look at it. Or depends who's evict who's on the other side of it. I have a habit of tuning out sections. Like I'll listen, I'll watch it like half an ear. Just I can get the gist of it and focus when it gets interesting. So this, so it didn't really, I really didn't pay much mind to it. So there's a few people out there that's been on the receiving end of me tuning them out. I'm like, yeah, uh-huh. Right. And I'm like, what the fuck did I just say yes to? Well, it was But as you're reading it, I'm like, okay, this is really annoying. Like the back and forth.

SPEAKER_01 14:12

I'm like, Because they just keep going back and forth, back and forth. And then every time she gets close to the case, she ends up hitting him. She's like, she's reminding me of Tom and Jerry.

SPEAKER_02 14:27

They're flirting with each other.

SPEAKER_01 14:28

Well, yeah. Hey everyone, Lisa here. I want to take a moment to tell you about this really cool travel backpack that I got. It's made by Muslim and it's so cool. As you know, Agnes and I are not in the same state. So we travel to see each other quite frequently. This backpack makes it so easy to do so. The bag has space for everything. When I fly, I don't like to check a bag. This makes it so easy for me to bring everything that I need with me on carry-on, including recording equipment. It has a space for everything. Trust me when I say that if you travel, even if it's just for a road trip, this bag is perfect for you. Go to muzzum.com now and use our promo code SASPOD for 20% off of your new bag. Trust me when I say you'll love it. Back at Saeed's tent, Shannon works on translating the map notations. She is disappointed to find that the job involves math and doubt she will be able to help. Don't worry, you have Saeed, the space age math genius.

SPEAKER_02 16:08

But I whatever, Saeed. Like major eye roll here.

SPEAKER_01 16:16

As her last resort, Kate turns to Jack, who is at the caves, asking Sun about the herbs she is gathering to use as a medicine for headaches. Kate reveals to Jack that the case belonged to the U.S. Marshal. When Jack asks about its contents, she adds that it contains four 9mm guns with a few boxes of ammo, some money, and the marshal's personal belongings. Kate then tells Jack that Sawyer now possesses the case and will soon open it and have the guns. She also reveals that the key to the case is buried in the marshal's wallet. Jack suspects that Kate has hidden motives and asks her if anything else in the case is of importance to her. Kate says she only fears the guns will fall into Sawyer's hands. Jack, skeptical, then tells her that he will only help if they open the case together, to which Kate agrees. Jack and Kate head to where Mars is buried and dig up his corpse. Was it something I said?

unknown 17:14

Oh.

SPEAKER_01 17:15

What happened? You got up. I was like, was this something I said?

SPEAKER_02 17:21

I had to get a cookie. And I would get like the crispy noodles from a Chinese restaurant. And every time I didn't get a bag of crispy noodles, they gave me a handful of cookies. So I got like all I have like a a a thing of cookies here if I get some munchies.

SPEAKER_01 17:42

I love Chinese food. Jack and Kate head to where Mars is buried and dig up his corpse. Kate volunteers to reach in and get the wallet, and after obtaining it, she jumps quickly out of the grave. When she opens the wallet, she acts disgusted because of the maggots inside and throws it on the ground. Jack picks it up again and looks inside but finds no key. Kate acts surprised, but Jack sees through her con and bitterly praises her attempts to hide the key while distracting him. Jack then grabs her hand and demands she open it. She opens her hand, revealing the key inside. She tries to explain, but the angered Jack refuses to listen and walks away with the key. Meanwhile, Said finds Shannon's translations of the French notations to be of no sense, asking if she's sure, holding no relation to the written equations. Apparently, the notations added by Rousseau are a repeated rambling of references to moon and silver sparkled sea. However, it all seems somehow familiar to Shannon. Said declares that the time they have spent was a mistake. This causes Shannon to feel frustrated with Said and herself as well, and she leaves in tears.

SPEAKER_02 18:56

Elsewhere, Jack The misogyny knows no bounds. Even on a deserted island, but go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 19:03

Well, okay, well, explain.

SPEAKER_02 19:05

So maybe you're just frustrated that it just didn't make sense in general, but I felt like it was more directed, maybe part of it was directed towards her personally. Like I should never have asked you. Like it was just like asking you was a mistake.

SPEAKER_01 19:21

And I So then he should he shouldn't have asked her instead of he just shouldn't have asked anyone.

SPEAKER_02 19:27

Yeah. Right. That's why I mean it might be a little bit of both. But I felt there was, I understand her frustration. Like she was like, listen, I told you my fridge isn't the best. And it just like maybe it was a little bit of, hey, maybe this whole thing was just crazy to begin with. But I felt like there was a little bit of a jab towards her, too. I think the way Boone treats her and slowly rubbing off her other the way people see her. And yeah, she's a shallow person. But like I said, I think that I always thought there's more to her, that's just more to her story. I think she's um, yeah, the way Boone treats her is just fucking weird. Like that overquieted love. I hate you because I love you so much. He's just weird. It's a little disturbing to me.

SPEAKER_01 20:21

We'll get an episode with them soon.

SPEAKER_02 20:24

Random ramblings of an insane woman.

SPEAKER_01 20:27

That's what your autobiography is gonna be called.

SPEAKER_02 20:34

I'm with the coffee table books.

SPEAKER_01 20:40

Every page is gonna just gonna be another quote from you.

SPEAKER_02 20:43

I think it'll be very interesting.

SPEAKER_01 20:45

You're gonna turn the page and be like, damn, she really was insane. What the fuck does this mean?

SPEAKER_02 20:52

Think about it. Like, really, I didn't think about it. Everything makes bad. I don't know. Leave me alone.

SPEAKER_01 21:02

That's page four.

SPEAKER_02 21:04

I don't know, leave me alone. Like every other page is like, I don't know, leave me alone.

SPEAKER_01 21:10

Elsewhere, Jack approaches Sawyer and asks him for the case. When Sawyer initially protests, Jack threatens to take him off his medication after inducing fear in him about the possible complications. Sawyer reluctantly hands Jack the case and asks him if Kate revealed what's inside. Jack, however, lies and says no. Before giving him the case, Sawyer warns Jack that Kate is lying about whatever reason she told him. Back at the caves, Kate and Jack open the case together, as he insisted. Jack is amazed to find that the contents are as Kate described, but with the addition of a yellow envelope marked personal effects, which he hands to Kate. Kate opens the envelope and pulls out a small toy airplane. When Jack demands that she tell him the truth about it, Kate initially says that it belonged to the man she loved. But after a struggle between them, she eventually cries out that it belonged to the man she killed. Shocked, Jack takes the case along with the guns and walks away.

SPEAKER_02 22:10

Okay. Who okay, obviously it says personal facts and you can tell to these sentimental, whatever the Who the fuck do you think you are demanding to know what it belonged to? Like, oh my god, I hate Jack for this particular reason. He's So judgmental, and he feels like he has the right to know everything about what's going on, especially in Kate's mind and what's Kate's heart. It's ridiculous. The hubris of this man. It makes me sick. It pisses me off to no end. But yeah. Like, and then either you're gonna help her get the case or you're not gonna help her get the case. The whole, you know, having conditions on it. Like either you trust her or you don't. Do it no. Don't trust her, but. Like I would have pushed her with a clip like two weeks ago. God fuck. Yes, I get very upset on fictional characters. But I get upset because fictional characters are based on real people. Like, you know what I mean? There are people like this. They need to be put in this spot quick, fast, in a hurry. I don't care about desert island or the middle of Times Square. Who the fuck do you think you are? Okay.

SPEAKER_01 23:26

That night on the beach, Rose continues to help Charlie come to terms with Claire's kidnapping. When Charlie questions her belief of getting reunited with her missing husband, Rose explains there's a fine line between denial and faith, which she feels is much better on her side. Charlie, in tears, asks her to help him. But Rose explains that she is not of such power, and then holds his hand while making a prayer for him. At the same time, Shannon approaches Said and tells him a story of her French boyfriend's son, Laurent, who repeatedly watched a French-dubbed cartoon about a fish. Apparently, the cartoon had a song with matching lyrics to its those notations. When Said asks her about the song, Shannon starts to say. I'm not sure how to pronounce it. La Mer. Paul watches them anger from behind the tree. Passing by them, Jack heads to the case with the case, but stops to look at Kate, who gazes at the fire with the face covered in tears. As he leaves, Kate starts to play. As he leaves, Kate starts to play with the toy airplane. You want to talk about themes? Let's talk about themes. Let's talk about themes.

SPEAKER_02 24:44

Let's talk okay.

unknown 24:47

Sorry.

SPEAKER_02 24:49

Let's just cabin fever.

SPEAKER_01 24:53

Overall, I feel like this episode tries to make Kate unlikable.

SPEAKER_02 25:00

Now you find I didn't find that. I didn't find her unlikable. I found her. I think I liked her more now.

SPEAKER_01 25:10

Explain.

SPEAKER_02 25:11

Explain mostly. Okay. Yes, the bank robbery, yes, there was shady business going on. But there's always there was something more to it. There was something, like, yeah, she didn't see when anyone would be hurt. Um, and she had ulterior motives that's something you could tell was quite personal to her. I think after we get to a certain age in our lives, we understand the quote unquote bad guys a little bit more. And I felt Jack was so unlikable that you had no choice but to feel for the case. They made Jack the complete dick. Well, I was like the dick. And maybe relatable.

SPEAKER_01 25:52

Well, the reason I say that is because we get more into her past and she orchestrated a bank robbery, and she shot a few people, and then when she's a hard theme, yeah. When she wanted the case, uh she uh she was more truthful with Jack than she was with Sawyer, but she still uh tried to do what she could to get it without having to be upfront because uh I don't think I don't like how Jack kind of micromanaged her and took out charge. But at the same time, Kate was the one who went to him for help, right? She had she had to know that there were gonna be conditions and she basically agreed to them, right? So now I'm not saying that it makes what Jack did right, but it makes it just makes it that Kate can't really complain because she agreed to it. Yeah, Jack pushed her, but all that for what? For plain?

SPEAKER_02 26:53

I think that's what the I think that's my whole point because it was something that was something sentimental and deep, and I'm sure there's more to it. Maybe not likable is a wrong word, but m relatable. Like you kind of get where she's coming from. And I get where uh I'm asking you for help. Lisa, hey, you I'm asking you asking me for help. But I'm like, all right, listen, you gotta be honest with me. I think, yeah, I think he was a little bit too my he was king of the world with the conditions. I get it. Yeah, because you honestly need help. If you need help with something, you're you would agree to almost anything, fair or not, you know. Yeah, when you're in a bad position.

SPEAKER_01 27:34

Okay, so when when she first went to Jack, she said, We have a problem, and his response was we or you? And she told him what was in the case. Did you think that she was being honest about what was in the case?

SPEAKER_02 27:47

No. I knew there was more to it. You knew but he but so did he, and you still decide to help her. So if you're going to help her, help her. I just think there was just a little bit too conditional, too much condition.

unknown 28:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:02

Like you know she's not being honest, you know there's holding more. So if you're gonna do what do. If you're not, you're not. Like when you lend someone out money, either you're gonna if you expect like me personally, if I'm gonna expect it back, I don't lend it. If that makes any sense.

SPEAKER_01 28:19

Well, if I lend somebody money, I expect it back. However, I don't lend out money unless I can live with the prospects of never getting it back.

SPEAKER_02 28:28

Like getting it back. That's exactly. Because I'm like, I'll lend it to you, I'm gonna, in my mind, it's gonna be a a gift. But I want my money back if I can get it back.

SPEAKER_03 28:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:38

Right, you know what I mean? So you're like, if I'm gonna help you, I'm gonna help you. If I don't trust you enough to help you, I'm not gonna help you. Either or you can't sit there and put conditions on your assistance. If you're gonna do it, do it. If you're not not, I don't get it. If you don't trust someone enough to help them, then you don't do it. It's survival. You want you want to have something over somebody. That's what I don't like about him. And I get where she's coming from, right, wrong, or indifferent. I relate to it on a human level. Like, I get where she's coming from. Was it the right thing? Maybe not, but you kind of get it. And I think on some levels, this is two weeks to these are that you guys are complete strangers. There's only so much of yourself you owe these two people. And she's giving Jack more than enough at this point of this friendship, this two-week forced friendship. Like you just don't get it. You just you just don't do it. I think she's and I think she has given she's done enough thus far personally. That's just me. I don't know. Leave me alone. Um if I'm ever a housewives, that'd be my tagline. Well, what do I know? Leave me alone.

SPEAKER_03 29:53

If you had a what?

SPEAKER_02 29:54

If I was a housewife, that'd be my tagline.

SPEAKER_01 30:00

Some other things that we got in this episode is the beach eroding and they had to move camps. And there was talking about how the beach is eroding so fast and it's unnatural. Mm-hmm. Any anything?

SPEAKER_02 30:15

I think everything about that island's unnatural. So you just take it with a grain of sand. Get it? Grain of sand, grain of salt. Yeah, at this point, you have to be like nothing. They've seen so much in this short amount of time, they need to be like, yeah, okay. Not surprised. Like, just chalk it up.

SPEAKER_01 30:36

When Jack wants Saeed to go talk to Rousseau, Saeed is pretty much Saeed is against it. He's in denial about the whispers that he may or may not have heard. But then he goes to ask Shannon for help. So what do you think about him and Shannon working together? Aside from him being like misogynist dick.

SPEAKER_02 31:00

I mean, you don't think much of it. I think I don't think you want to ask Rousseau about it because I think he was a little punkish. Like he used to want to the smart thing to do was go to the French woman about French, but I think um but that's just logical. Okay, and could it be that he I don't know. You could take it so many things that he was it could be like a simple as he was afraid to go back out there and experience that. Or could it have been Rousseau kind of I think he feels exposed when he's with her? Like he sees the bullshit, I think, a little bit. So let me ask the girl, let me ask it, the shallow girl who doesn't speak much French, starts to feel superior again. Maybe I've and then it's also I'm reading way too much into it.

SPEAKER_01 31:51

You you've got some theories that I've never heard before.

SPEAKER_02 31:56

I don't know how to take that, Lisa.

SPEAKER_01 31:59

Take it at face value. I've just never heard them.

SPEAKER_02 32:02

I think too much about nothing. That's exactly what it is.

SPEAKER_01 32:06

And then towards the end, when they're when she's telling him about the song, Boone is watching them like a complete fucking creeper.

SPEAKER_02 32:14

You know how I think about Boone. I mean, I don't like anybody, do I? I like Flock.

SPEAKER_01 32:22

What about okay, we didn't even see Jen in this episode. We still nobody looked for Claire. And how about the scene with Rose and Charlie? Their little pairing. Rose prays for Charlie. I thought it was sweet.

SPEAKER_02 32:37

I thought that was a very healing scene.

SPEAKER_01 32:40

I think Charlie is just so distraught and so feeling guilty that he couldn't do anything, and now he just has to basically sit on his hands because he feels defeated almost.

SPEAKER_02 32:53

Yeah, but also remember at this time he he's going I mean he's not he's not going through the physical aspects of withdrawal, but he's still going through, you know, he hasn't had any drugs. He went through a horrible experience with the crazy dude. Claire pregnant, Claire's MIA, and God knows what's happening to him. So Rose, I think it's helped him get it back together again. Like she said, there's denial and then it's fate. That's what she said. I'm like, oh, okay. So that was a very healing scene for him, I believe. And I like Charlie. So I think I was I was mooting for him to, you know, to find his inner strength.

SPEAKER_01 33:32

Rose also makes another reference about her husband.

SPEAKER_02 33:36

Right.

SPEAKER_01 33:37

Who may or may not be alive. Thoughts?

SPEAKER_02 33:40

I believe that people on some level who you just know. So I think on some level it's like hope. But I think on some this is sixth sense, someone that you're connected to, a child, a spouse, or someone, you know, I think when they're gone. So yeah, I think he um if Rose's husband pops up later on, totally would not be surprised. I'm kind of half expecting it. And mind you, those who can't see us, Miss Lisa, who's seen this seen the show, is looking like hmm, I don't know. Just a tease me.

SPEAKER_01 34:21

They give you nothing with my poker face.

SPEAKER_02 34:24

Nothing. I know nothing. If anyone knows where that show where that came from, what show that is, I have nothing to give you, but you win like coolest listener ever. Nothing. I know nothing. So yes, call in and then we know where that's from. You went coolest listener ever.

SPEAKER_01 34:50

Let's talk about the title.

SPEAKER_02 34:52

What was the title, whatever the case may be?

SPEAKER_01 34:54

Yeah. So you know that they pretty much always have some kind of a double meaning.

SPEAKER_02 34:59

Okay, so obviously the case.

SPEAKER_01 35:01

Right.

SPEAKER_02 35:02

The physical, literal case, whatever the case may be. Um, I guess it leads to the uncertainty of whatever, everyone's uncertainty of Rose's husband, uncertainty of what's going on with Claire, whatever the case may be, what the words and the lyrics of the song means to the map. But yeah, I don't think about the name of the titles as much as you probably want me to think about it. I completely spinball that shit.

SPEAKER_01 35:32

Well, I I like your take on it, but I was thinking it more so referred to Kate, as in whatever her deal is, because we still really don't know. We've gotten two flashback scenes about her and we still really don't know. And nothing.

SPEAKER_02 35:47

No shit about her.

SPEAKER_01 35:48

We I love that. So we still have no fucking idea if this is why the marshal was after her, what the deal with the plane is, w what the fuck. Kate, what the fuck?

SPEAKER_02 36:00

I think this scene leads to what the marshals were after her for. For some reason, I don't think this was it. I think it was the linchpin of why she was on the run. I don't know why. That's just my I feel it in my bones. And I am probably a hundred percent wrong.

SPEAKER_01 36:19

But you shall just have to wait for another Kate scene.

SPEAKER_02 36:26

That's bigger that look again, people. I don't know. Every time you do that look, I'm gonna we're gonna have a drinking game.

SPEAKER_01 36:35

Yes, let's do it.

SPEAKER_02 36:37

How about I'm alcohol poisoning.

SPEAKER_01 36:39

Every time Sawyer says son of a bitch, we should drink too. Or Hurley says dude. We'll be dead.

SPEAKER_02 36:44

Okay. Seriously, I mean I have like a law, I've like practice, but still every episode will be a different thing.

SPEAKER_01 36:53

You prefer trivias or characters?

SPEAKER_02 36:56

Um always pick trivia. Like trivia sucks lately, because I'm like, okay, and but the good trivia is probably spoilers. So I'm like, okay, let's do characters.

SPEAKER_01 37:08

Okay. Let's talk about Kate. I think we did, but let's talk about Kate.

SPEAKER_02 37:13

Okay. My opinion of Kate is what I said earlier. There you go.

SPEAKER_01 37:18

So you don't you just you kind of feel the same about her?

SPEAKER_02 37:21

Yeah. Okay. I like her well enough.

unknown 37:24

All right.

SPEAKER_01 37:28

Next episode is technically Boon, but Shannon is in it. So let's hear your thoughts about Boone.

SPEAKER_02 37:37

Dude, he's a cr I don't like him. He's I think he's insecure. There's something about him the way he did dog on Shannon. I said this many times before, it's very insecure, and it's kind of that psychotic response to overquiet love that I get. Like, uh, I I I love you so much, I hate you. Like there's something real weird and incestuous with Boone. Like, I don't get it. It's creepy. But anyway.

SPEAKER_01 38:07

Okay. Alright, so now your favorite part trivia. This episode features the first appearance of the second beach camp.

SPEAKER_02 38:19

The first appearance of the second beach camp?

SPEAKER_01 38:22

Yeah, meaning when they had a move because of the tides.

SPEAKER_02 38:27

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 38:33

The next one I don't know if I should read it. It's a little bit of a spoiler. Not much, but a little bit.

SPEAKER_02 38:42

Go ahead. Just throw balls to the walls and go for it.

SPEAKER_01 38:45

Balls to the wall. When the first chimp is being washed away by the tide, Saeed describes the tide as changing too quickly. This is one of the earliest references in the show to time passing differently on the island. Interesting.

SPEAKER_02 39:05

See, that's a cool one. I like that.

SPEAKER_01 39:10

Okay, I'm gonna read half of this next one because the other part will just ruin shit. This is the first time the toy plane Kate cares so much for is seen. So we'll see it again.

SPEAKER_02 39:23

So that leads me to believe that there's gonna be a next time the toy plank. It'll come back.

SPEAKER_01 39:30

It'll come back.

SPEAKER_02 39:31

Okay. It'll come back. That's a note. Keep that toy plane in the back in the back burner with everything else we threw back there.

SPEAKER_01 39:43

This episode features the first appearance of the waterfall. I'm not gonna say more.

SPEAKER_03 39:48

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 39:49

Claire does not appear and is not credited. Walt appears without speaking lines. And this was the highest rated episode of season one on ABC. And it's the only episode to score the highest rating of a season without being the season's premiere. The behind-the-scenes reason for the unusual tides that are about to submerge the fuselage was that the actual seasonal tides on the north shore of Olaho would have eventually flooded the shooting site for real. Thereby submerging the fuselage set and causing an ecological disaster. Therefore, an in-story reason had to be found for the survivors moving their camp to a different location. So they had a they had to figure out a reason.

SPEAKER_02 40:33

Okay, that's kind of cool. I like Becca, that was kind of cool.

SPEAKER_01 40:36

Most of the cast get a wardrobe change in this episode. The underwater scenes were not filmed in Hawaii, but instead in a tank in LA. Anything else before we close this bad boy down?

SPEAKER_02 40:55

No. I think uh this is uh made my points clear how I feel about Jack. I mean, I don't I think I was clear, I'm not sure. If I voiced my opinion clearly or not. Yeah, no questions. So I wonder why this was the highest rated episode. Like what was the commercial for this episode? Like, what was going on? Like what day did it air? Like I'm kind of like I wanna know like the who's, the what, the why. It oh, it aired January 5th, 2005.

SPEAKER_01 41:33

So this must have been like the mid like a midseason type break, you know, like Christmas.

SPEAKER_02 41:39

Maybe there was nothing else on. Like, you know what I mean? Like everyone goes with hiatus.

SPEAKER_01 41:44

Let's let's think about something. In the last episode, you got before the last episode was all the best cowboys have daddy issues, and that episode aired on December 8th. So it's almost a whole month. And in that episode, it kind of left on a cliffhanger. Locke and Boone found something in the ground. We had the whole thing with Ethan and Charlie.

SPEAKER_02 42:14

So that's what it was. It was a coming to a cliffhanger, it was hopefully closing a cliffhanger, which it didn't. Nope. But um everyone was like, oh, what happened what's going on? What's happening? Okay, thank you. Because that would kind of bug me. Would it be like just like the highest rating? Like, what happened? What happened? Just my damn middle of the season. I need to know. But yeah, I feel better now. Thank you. You're welcome. Thank you, Lost Mistress.

SPEAKER_01 42:40

Let's wrap this up and then we will reconvene when it's time to do Hearts and Minds.

SPEAKER_02 42:47

That sounds like a plan.

SPEAKER_01 42:48

Well, that'll do it for this episode. Stay tuned next week when we will be discussing Hearts and Minds. If you'd like to support this show, we can be found at patreon.com slash Saspod. Everything helps. If you'd like to connect with us on social media, you can find us on Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter. We also have an email address and a hotline where we can be reached. All of our contact info will be in the show notes. Thank you so much for listening and spending time with us. Please don't forget to rate, review, and subscribe because that will also help support the show. And please always remember to drink responsibly. Until next time.

SPEAKER_02 44:10

Well 40 mile per hour windows. But just put it to put it that way. Now, mind you, every plane crash on TV, they always crash when it's beautiful weather. It's never bad weather. So we should be safe.

SPEAKER_03 44:25

All right.

SPEAKER_02 44:27

I mean, I guess you have a point. If you if you want to use TV, you know, TV logic. I can't argue with that. Somewhere beyond the sea. Somewhere waiting for me. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 44:48

Well, I think then we should just include your rendition.

SPEAKER_02 44:51

Yeah, we don't want that. I go to bed. That goes really. I like that song. Okay. I could should I could you know what? I should sing it in French.